British English vs. American English: Surprised by usage and pronunciation (2023)

Do you look for “eggplant” or “eggplant” when shopping for vegetables? What you say depends on where you learned English. American editor Pam Nelson and British author Samantha White discuss the rise of "awesome," why seemingly simple words have different pronunciations in the UK and US, and much more in this sequel toA discussionin words like "Scheme" and "Boondoggle" launched in June 2019 and a series of popular quizzes aboutFMsite one2017mi2018.

What you will learn from this episode:

• How English speakers pronounce "niche" in different parts of the world: there are apparently more than two ways.
• When "amazing" was used regularly.
• Why a guest says saying "amazed" can be redemptive.
• How English speakers in India contribute to our global lexicon.
• A bit of history on the term "chalk up" and how it is sometimes confused with "chock up".

Play the following episode or read the edited transcript:

To comment on this podcast episode or suggest an idea for another episode, please contact Neil Amato atFMEditor-in-chief of the magazineNeil.Amato@aicpa-cima.com.

Transcription:

Amato:We had that first conversation in the spring of 2019. The bottom line of that conversation on the podcast episode page read: "American editor Pam Nelson and British author Samantha White talk about times when words confused them or made them laugh. ". educate.

So let's jump to our first word. It's more a matter of pronunciation than meaning. The word is spelled N-I-C-H-E. This is also N-I-C-H-E. It seems such a simple word. When I see this written, I would say niche, as in niche industry or niche publishing, but I'm American. I never did French.

So Sam, I'll start with you. What are you saying?

Blanco:I definitely say niche ("neesh"). I think this is a very good example of a word that can cause confusion between US and UK speakers, even though the spelling and usage are exactly the same. I first heard the American pronunciation "Nitch" in context, specifically about a business or freelancer finding or identifying their specific niche, specialty, or target market. So the meaning was made clear to me from the context, but in preparation for this discussion I asked some friends what they would understand if they heard someone say "Nitsch" and it caused varying degrees of confusion. They all agreed that it sounded like an uncomfortable medical complaint.

So I thought about what other words we British English speakers have adopted French pronunciations that most have to do with food or art, like quiche for example. There are many terms, obviously legal. For example, force majeure, an insurance policy that has probably come into play quite often in recent months. And then there's our old friendPath("Root")obroken ("broken"), depending on which side of the Atlantic you are.

But I think the most interesting point for me is that American English and British English get their influences from different places. For example, in British English we have vegetables called zucchini and aubergine following the French, but in the American equivalent you would call them zucchini and aubergine and this reflects different communities and different influences. So I thought that uncomfortable medical ailments aside, this was a really interesting discovery.

Amato:I learned something new about zucchini and eggplant. I had seen those words while reading, but I had no idea that the ones you just said are the same as zucchini and eggplant.

Nelson:Right, and an American speaker could use "aubergine" to refer to a color, the color of the eggplant. Then I remember going to work one day in a purple pantsuit; it's been a long time ok And one of my colleagues described it as "eggplant", and I think that's the first time I've ever heard someone say that word. He had read it but I didn't hear anyone say it. Yes, and it was the color of an eggplant. It was a strange purple.

Blanco:neto

Nelson:Forgot what the word for zucchini is?

Blanco:Zucchini.

Nelson:Right. I have never heard an American speaker say that word unless he was influenced by Britain. In an American dictionary, the dictionary authors said that "nitch" was actually an older pronunciation and that they speculated that the "neesh" pronunciation was some kind of fad, I think, or not just a French influence, but a French influence. recent. French. But these days I think there are people in America who say "neesh" because maybe they were influenced by listening to British TV shows or English speakers saying "neesh." I still say "Nitch" and agree with you that the I-T-C-H sound sounds like a condition.

Amato:It's interesting that you mentioned Quiche, because actually, I would never say "Quitch."

Nelson:And this is a very good example of how we would proceed with a meal, whatever the French pronunciation.

Amato:Another thing about that. I actually looked up the pronunciation online and it actually said the UK, US pronunciation, but there were two little sound files for the US and one was "nitch" and the other was one I don't think that no one has heard. say. It actually said "finish" like N-I-S-H. So this was new.

Nelson:MI.

Amato:So we've definitely found our niche with that conversation. We are on our way. Again, I'll start with Sam because one word I've heard all too often is "cool." If you were responding to good news, what would you say, brilliant or great? First, I think for you two, really, does anyone know where "cool" came from, and especially for Sam, was it something you found a lot of when you started working with publishers in the US?

Blanco:I think "unbelievable" is one of the most popular examples of when people talk about the nature of American cultural imperialism and the British start saying "great", probably in the late 90s as a result of TV or movies, or would be now It's social media and things like that. It is what resonates the most with people who want to defend pure English or British English. And I understand the anger, because to me, amazement, amazement, amazement, amazement, should be reserved for a very specific context.

I could marvel at an artist's ability to capture a landscape, or if I could see the Northern Lights, I would definitely be in awe. But just finding out that your team won this week or whatever doesn't surprise you, unless it's the championship final or whatever. So it's special, the one that makes people nervous, as we say here.

I would say, and I have found myself doing this the last few days, I would say "brilliant." "This is brilliant news," or there's a certain presenter here who is "incredible," which I really like because it's quite dramatic. He is very emphatic. And the contagion is there. I used "amazing" and then thought, "Ugh, that's not natural. It's not natural to my language."

And I think part of this is also a cultural thing, as British English speakers are often not comfortable showing as much enthusiasm as the word 'incredible' suggests for anything, and our reactions are a bit more guarded. So I would say "brilliant" is about as far as we can comfortably go in terms of praise or expression.

Nelson:However, it will be interesting for you to know that I read a linguist who wrote about "great" and found a reference in 1977, a letter to the editor where, what newspaper were you in? I forget. It wasLos Angeles TimesNewspaper in which a reader complained that people used the word "awesome" to mean something really good. And I was surprised that it was that far back, 1977. I mean, it might be bias on my part, but I don't think I've heard much before the '80s or even the late '80s, I resisted for a long time. time because it sounded like a buzz word. , a term linguists use for something that appears in the language and then suddenly explodes.

Anyway, the woman who wrote thisLos Angeles TimesI just didn't think "amazing" should be used because it means something that blows your mind; similar to the word horrible, which has almost the opposite meaning. When something is great, it is really great. If something is terrible, you fear it or you hate it. Another wonderful thing about English is that a root can go in two different directions.

Yesterday I used the word "awesome" with someone, but I was trying to talk to someone younger, so I thought, "Oh, I'll tell him what was cool so he understands what I mean, it was really cool." But I think that's a bit too much of a buzzword, but still.

Blanco:Very interesting what you said about buzzwords. I've never heard of the term as such, but I think that all words used to express something fabulous or great or whatever tend to change or at least go through a cycle very quickly. Because if you're thinking, I don't know, the '60s and '70s "cool," then "cool," then "fabulous," then "wicked." And I think it's regional too. When I went to school in London it was 'awesome' something would be 'awesome' whereas in the North West of England something would be called 'mint'.

And like you said about the younger person you spoke to, I'm not in touch with the newer ones that teens and 20-year-olds are wearing right now, but they certainly wouldn't be the ones I would wear.

Amato:I have heard "mint" several times. I can't remember the setting, but when I first heard it, I was like, wow, what? This is a synonym for "incredible." Why can't you just use awesome?

Nelson:Oh amazing!

Amato:Yes of course. I don't think I have anything else to say other than to say that my extensive research, which consisted of looking up the word on the wikipedia page, said that it was first used because it was in a 1970 movie that I think was called Torah. ! Trunk! Trunk!" It was about the attack on Pearl Harbor.

Nelson:And it was great"? Hmm.

Amato:1970.

Nelson:It was a big movie in 1970. I remember it being very, very popular, but it was also one of those movies where he was popular because he was so big. It was a great movie. But I'm really surprised that he came across "amazing" in this movie because it wasn't a teen movie.

Amato:Interesting. Let me say that we are shooting on October 1, 2020. We are definitely in the era of social distancing. The last time we recorded this show, Pam and I were in our office in Durham, North Carolina, and we were talking to Sam over Zoom. This time I'm at my house, Pam is at her house, Sam is at her house. So here we are all separately for this recording. In the age of social distancing, people on both sides of the Atlantic need to know and understand the word 'queue', which is Q-U-E-U-E. What else would you like to say about the word "tail" or "tail to tail"?

Nelson:I think this is a British term that has really moved beyond American usage. I think people say, and part of that might be because of computer language, because when you're talking about something, a lot of the things that a computer does is called a queue, so I think going in is our job. at the Association, our list of stories we are working on on the computer is a queue. And then I think it came into use. But I don't know if it's very common for people to say "I'm in the coffee line" instead of "in the coffee line." I think this probably doesn't happen that often. But it is becoming a bit more common in the United States.

So I'm going to talk about the rabbit hole that I fell down when I started, because I think the first time I heard queuing in this use, not as a pool cue, but as a queuing for a line, was in an old Western on TV and there was a Chinese character in the late 19th century and many Chinese came to work on the railway. And, of course, it was about how they were treated badly and the terrible prejudice people had towards the Chinese. But they had, I'll show you now, but they had the hairstyle where the man had a long braid that went down the back from the top of his head to his back, and in westerns they called it a braid, and I think that was the plot point that someone cut your braid, cut your braid.

That's all to say the first time I think I heard the word "cola" and it's from Latin, it went into French, which was a French term and it came from Latin, fromKoda, and that's the Latin word for "tail," T-A-I-L. And you see it again in a coda in a piece of music; It comes at the end of a piece of music. So I began to wonder if this is related to the code as in the Tax Code and the Code of Conduct and there is a similar word. It is a code that is literally the trunk of a tree, but it is also a book. So from there, the code came from that line and not from the other line leading to the queue.

Anyway, a tail is literally a line, so I think the British got it from the French and now may or may not be getting a little more out of the UK, but what's interesting to me, I love the etymology of anyway, but it was really interesting to me that it literally comes from the word "tail" and therefore the word "tail" passed into French and then into English.

Amato:Interesting.

Blanco:Fascinating, so you took from Latin, French, all the different influences, and what reminded me when you said that the codex is in the museum of anthropology in Mexico City, there are the Mayan codices, so all the writing and hieroglyphic writing Maya. known as Codex. So yes, we can always bring more cultures.

Amato:Any more thoughts on queues or queues?

Blanco:Apart from the fact that it's hardwired into British DNA to queue and if you're waiting for a bus or something and queuing isn't respected, it seems like a personal insult, then yes.

Amato:Oh you mean when you're standing at a bus stop and instead of just walking there has to be a proper queue for there to be an order if there aren't enough seats on the bus?

Blanco:Absolute, eg.

Nelson:Right. Would you say someone crossed the line if...

Blanco:Absolute, eg.

Nelson:We would say "broken line". If someone got in line before another, he would break the line, and we don't like that either. And it is also the difference between online and online. And I went online, wouldn't you say it's more of an upstate thing, Neil? I think people in Brooklyn would say, "I stood in line" instead of "I stood in line."

Amato:I've definitely heard both. I'm not sure I can narrow it down to Brooklyn, but I know I heard it.

Nelson:Maybe I'm just saying the northeast part up there.

Amato:Here is one that appeared recently. Someone pointed out some differences to me. I've noticed when someone in the US says "I need to call you" they can say "I'll call you back" or "I'll get back to him". I've noticed the usage among my UK colleagues is "this person hasn't contacted me" or "he hasn't contacted you yet". You didn't respond." So it's a small difference, but something I noticed. Sam, do you have anything to say about this?

Blanco:Personally, I think it would make a difference in meaning between the two terms. I'd say "get in touch" is too vague a commitment for me, with no set deadline. So if someone calls you about a job you posted and they apply for the job or something, and you do but you're not really interested or something, you can say, "I'll get in touch," as in 'Get out of my phone line, please'. But there is no obligation. "Let me come back to you" is more concrete, more committed to me. At least it implies that I intend to do something. find out the answer to your question and it will inform you. So there is a more concrete type of action.

Amato:Got it. And with "I'll get back to you", "I'll get back to you", "I'll get back to you", the word "revert" is probably used as well. Sam, do you have any idea about the use of that word?

Blanco:To me, the word "return" means that something goes back to a previous state. However, the Cambridge Dictionary refers to it as an example of Indian English. Using it in this context to respond seems quite technical, unnatural, like a chatbot talking to you. But it would certainly make sense for Indian English terms to become more widespread in use, especially in the business environment with call centers and all the tech companies and everything else, software, considering there are at least 125 million speakers. of English in India. So some oncoming traffic, some British and American English influence, would make a lot of sense.

The one I found by googling is quite intriguing. Apparently, in Indian English they use "prepone" as the opposite - quite a useful invention - of "postpone". So, to fill a meaning gap: "Let's move on." And as a journalist who always works on time, of course, anticipating a meeting fills me with horror, so please don't submit anything.

But yes, I found this invention to fill a gap where there was not a word, let's say not a single word, it was really very interesting.

Amato:So, basically, you're saying that if a meeting was booked or scheduled for noon on Friday, could you move it up to 2:00 p.m. m. from Thursday?

Blanco:Yes, and that would be terrible.

Amato:I agree.

Nelson:I think it's great that English is constantly changing, that there are always new influences from other languages ​​or just different variants of English. It's good, I think, we have some English, although it also filled me with anxiety preparing a meeting. I think this is terrible.

Blanco:In fact.

Amato:This could be on my language bingo list, it's something I've talked about but don't play often. So I hope people don't criticize us for choosing that word and when I say poke I mean criticize or smash or hit us and I'm kidding about that. I didn't know that word could be a verb in that sense, as in "One shouldn't pawn someone who is late for a meeting in the pandemic era." They have no idea what their schedule is like while they are at home.” Sam, more on this?

Nelson:I just wanted to say that this is a perfect example of how this word is used, but I hadn't heard of it either, so I'm excited to explain a bit more about it.

Blanco:So, to use the word "slate" as a verb, this is what I think of when someone talks about a new movie that just came out and says, "Oh, it was announced in the press." It could be a book, a movie, a play, and it got horrible reviews. That's the immediate connotation I have for it. You could fuck someone up, but it's more of a fucked up thing, I'd say.

And the other use would be in a bar or restaurant when you say, "Oh, put this on my whiteboard." It's just a bill or invoice that needs to be paid later, and that's because back in the day there would literally be a piece of blackboard that the bar or restaurant owner would have scratched off his bill and kept track of what he spent. and how much. you owed them a lot

Nelson:If you said "chalk," that's exactly what it means. So when someone says, "I blamed it on his stupidity or something," it's like writing on a blackboard with a piece of chalk. As an editor, I sometimes come across the fact that people write like "Surprise", C-H-O-C-K, and I want to get paid every time I fix that in a story. That would be great. I think people hear it that way, and "cut" is of course an entirely different thing. It's like lifting something on a wedge or a piece of wood or something.

Anyway, sorry to miss it, but "chalk" is just one of those phrases that keeps coming up, and I wish I could explain to people that it's written on a blackboard with a piece of chalk.

Blanco:What students were doing here well into the 20th century, actually into the middle of the 20th century. But just to extend that tangent, we attribute a lot of things to experience, or if you try something and it goes wrong, it's like, "Oh Oh , put it down to experience, to experience. We're going to learn from this. We're making progress." And what you said about the wedge, that chalk-for-wedge misunderstanding, here we use wedge for block. When it's like, "Oh yeah, I was at the supermarket, but it was full and I had to leave."

Nelson:Yeah, that's a great term, filler.

Amato:And does that really mean it was too full?

Blanco:Yeah, it's basically wall to wall people.

Amato:We will end with a word that I have always liked. I don't think I use it much. I think I know what it means, but Pam Nelson will explain it in more detail. The word is shocking or being shocked.

Nelson:Okay, that means you're speechless, something made you speechless, and that can be good or bad I guess. From the etymology I've been looking at, it comes from a British word-of-mouth slang, "gob", and from World Wide Words, an online site, a blog that a colleague used to run and was long Marvelous. It's a bit removed now, but the entries are still there, and it talks about "gob" which is slang for the North of England and Scotland, gob, and then the verb smacked, so if anyone is totally surprised.

That's a word I think comes up a lot in US English when people talk about being dumbstruck, and we've probably heard it on UK TV. I'm not sure. I couldn't find it for sure. In a way, it's almost onomatopoeic because it says almost exactly what it is. If you're flabbergasted, I'm gesturing again now so you don't see anything on the podcast other than a palm-to-face gesture.

Anyway, I think British slang has something to do with it, because apparently "gob" isn't a word a decent person would use all the time. Sometimes the meaning seems too low, but "bewildered" even sounds a bit high to me as an American listener, perhaps because I associate it with the British.

Blanco:I agree with what you say about onomatopoeia. It's really powerful. It's quite cathartic to say, "I'm in awe."

Similarly, I looked up the Macmillan dictionary and it says there's written evidence that it's been in use since the 1930s, but it's been in spoken slang for much longer. And 'gob' as you say, my mum scolded me for using the word 'gob' because it's not pronounced correctly, but it seems to be Irish and Scottish Gaelic and means 'mouth', so come on. But it's pretty colloquial here, but I think it's probably used more often now.

Amato:Thanks Pam and Sam. That was excellent. I really appreciate her time. I tell listeners that I hope it was a great step through on that nitch or neesh issue and that everyone is really surprised and shares with their friends instead of judging our choices. Thanks again.

Blanco:Fabulous. Thanks a lot.

Nelson:Thanks a lot.